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Those a/f ratios are stupid rich, rings and plugs don't stand a chance. For that money, a pipe would do much more for this bike. These things just make you seem like it's faster cause your brains gotta make excuses for spending that kind money on someones mystery box. I have a article somewhere in dirt wheels I think that talks about tuners. Most are made by the one company and them just branded. I know for a fact the two brothers atv tuners are made that way. Just bullshit boxes, it's what we call em around work, and we've proven time and time again.

Sorry if I'm stepping on any toes, but this crap just ain't worth it. Unless you got dyno time or a tuning wizard this does nothing good.
 

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No BS on EFI boxes. That's the same as saying jets are bogus snake oil for carbs... It's a product that's BEYOND well proven.
 

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17.22 for the blue curve is lean. The graph shows that by adding fuel they got more power. They enriched the mixture to better reflect the typical target of 13.8 for optimum power.

I'm interested in the interface with the programmer and any more info you may have. Are they adding an O2 sensor like the Bazzaz system or loading predetermined maps from dyno runs.

Laptop interface? Any info would be helpful to better understand the system.
 

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This might sound stupid but any harm with running this lean? And would there be any harm done by going with the power commander ECU or anything like and running it for a while?
 

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The stock Honda map is the lean one. The aftermarket map is spot on. Honda chose lean for emissions and mpg no doubt. Unlike a 2 stroke, running a 4 stroke lean is a matter of loosing performance more than blowing a motor up to degree. That said, it's not doing it any favors either...
 

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wow tune is alot smoother with the tune.
 

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Those AFRs look a lot better! Wow, to think that a full exhaust adds about 1hp, then this in combination another 1hp, we're talking some solid gains for a little motor. Gets me even more excited for 170cc/cam/head!
 

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For many they are bullshit boxes, cause they think I plug this in i'm making alot more HP. Well without dyno time and money, they are bullshit. I've seen what one prograsmmed well can do, but for 400 bucks, i'll pass.
 

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Well I have to say it's an awesome improvement from stock and I ran my grom with out the PC and it ran like poo with the exhaust. Still think it needs some tuning but it really does feel like it revs faster for sure and the throttle feels a lil better too.
 

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For many they are bullshit boxes, cause they think I plug this in i'm making alot more HP. Well without dyno time and money, they are bullshit. I've seen what one prograsmmed well can do, but for 400 bucks, i'll pass.
You can usually find these from various (reputable) sites for under $300 if that makes you feel any better.

TwoBros will probably release their juicebox as well. Even the pro version only retails around $250 and they use the same maps as the power commander.
 

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The TBR juice box is one of the one size fits all boxes I talked about. TBR buys them from a company that produces them, slaps on a sticker and wham a Juice box. FMF is the same way. If I could find the article, i'd put it up.
 

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I tend to agree somewhat on the fact that its a bs box. If its the best tuning setup you have then by all means but its a piggyback. Who is gonna try to microsquirt theirs? I feel that that question might warrant its own thread
 
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